High Vis

L

Livia329

Guest
I was looking for a new backpack for use on my bike (which would most likely have the choice of black or high vis) and came across this article which I found quite interesting.

http://www.whitedalton.co.uk/motorbike-blog/2012/10/does-hi-vis-motorcycle-clothing-work/

I'm personally not a fan. But if it gets me seen then so be it - even that being said I'd never go overboard with it.

What's your views on it? Worth it or waste of time/money?


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Re: High Vis

:cool:......I have looked and can find no scientific evidence that backs up manufacturers claims that ?high-visibility clothing? is of any benefit to bike riders. It doesn't seem to matter what the rider is wearing if drivers are not paying attention. In fact, what evidence I can find seems to suggest that Hi-viz clothing gives a rider a false sense of security and thus rendering them more susceptible to to being hit by a non-attentive motorist.

:frown:.....I am quite happy to be proved wrong on this and would be genuinely interested to see any rigorous research that backs up the wearing of Hi-Vis apparel.

:redface:......of course, I shall continue to wear my Hi-Vis manikini in the bedroom.
 
Re: High Vis

If given the chance I would go with some of that "Black" high-vis that is available today to stand out a bit better at night.

The motorcycle test now puts more emphasis on self preservation, watching out for other assholes around that do not take enough notice of what's going on around.

No good lying on the slab or hospital bed with yourself or others thinking it wasn't your fault, ride/drive watching out for all possible dangers from others and road conditions.
 
Re: High Vis

I wear Hi Viz when I commute through the winter.
On those murky evenings when its been pissing down and all you can see is a wall of grey with red lights in it I'll take any advantage I can get.It's pretty effective if you've ever seen the motorway workers at the side of the road at night.
Don't wear it in summer though , my textile suit and boots have little reflective bits that are good enough.

Steve
 
Re: High Vis

One benefit of wearing a full hi-vis jacket on a big commuter bike (especially a white one) is that it tends to have the effect of "parting the waves" in traffic.
Don't know why.......
 
Re: High Vis

Personally, i wear summat hi-viz every time i ride, as i have a black bike & helmet that seems to blend in to the background. As has been said already, others will see only what they want to see, but if you take all reasonable precautions, then it can only help your case should summat go to court. A dayglo vest is only a few quid, & joy of joys, Livi, you can have one in dayglo pink if you so desire! Oh, & wearing a dayglo vest & then carrying a black rucksack on yer back......stupid.:60277EB7B04744289C0
 
Re: High Vis

stevel said:
I wear Hi Viz when I commute through the winter.
On those murky evenings when its been pissing down and all you can see is a wall of grey with red lights in it I'll take any advantage I can get.It's pretty effective if you've ever seen the motorway workers at the side of the road at night.
Don't wear it in summer though , my textile suit and boots have little reflective bits that are good enough.

Steve
Click to expand...

Don't ride in it myself. All the studies I've read over the past year persuade me that no matter what you wear, it's what the driver sees, or doesn't see, that makes the only difference visually. I'm going to go on assuming (maybe wrongly) that loud pipes save lives.

In fog or dismal conditions, I'm sure it might make some difference, at least for those driving behind you.

I'll stick to riding as defensively as I can, though as quickly as I'm able (or comfortable with).

Edit: Just had a thought. As my bike has permanently-on running lights in the indicators, maybe I should assume they'd help people see me. That' I've never thought about it until now probably means I haven't assumed any such thing.
 
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Re: High Vis

A few months back, some of us here in East Kent went on a free 'Biker Down' riders first aid course run by a fella with the local Fire Brigade (the theory being that often the first person at the scene of a bike accident will be the accompanying 'biker mate). Safe helmet removal, dealing with catastrophic (loss of hands, feet, limbs..) injuries, and also the value, or not, of Hi-Viz gear - essntially I think they were saying it depends on what the background is; ie. it's very easy to miss certain Hi-Viz designs in certain urban settings and you'll actually be camouflaged, same with day-time running lights. We were shown videos of these effects in action, too. I think, due to their successes these courses are being rolled out more widely across the country now and I would recommend 110% that you go along if you get the opportunity.Ride safely
 
Re: High Vis

Thanks for the replies guys.

Phssthpok said:
:redface:......of course, I shall continue to wear my Hi-Vis manikini in the bedroom.
Click to expand...

:9399D3F58B324EE1B68 I hope your wife likes your style :A:

Urrell said:
If given the chance I would go with some of that "Black" high-vis that is available today to stand out a bit better at night.

The motorcycle test now puts more emphasis on self preservation, watching out for other assholes around that do not take enough notice of what's going on around.

No good lying on the slab or hospital bed with yourself or others thinking it wasn't your fault, ride/drive watching out for all possible dangers from others and road conditions.
Click to expand...

Will look into the black high vis thanks. And yes of course! Everyone wants to kill you.

stevel said:
I wear Hi Viz when I commute through the winter.
On those murky evenings when its been pissing down and all you can see is a wall of grey with red lights in it I'll take any advantage I can get.It's pretty effective if you've ever seen the motorway workers at the side of the road at night.
Don't wear it in summer though , my textile suit and boots have little reflective bits that are good enough.

Steve
Click to expand...

Mhmm my jacket has reflective bits on it maybe that's all I need as I don't currently have much want or need to use the bike in the freezing cold, or in foggy conditions, especially not as a new rider.

mr. pitts said:
Personally, i wear summat hi-viz every time i ride, as i have a black bike & helmet that seems to blend in to the background. As has been said already, others will see only what they want to see, but if you take all reasonable precautions, then it can only help your case should summat go to court. A dayglo vest is only a few quid, & joy of joys, Livi, you can have one in dayglo pink if you so desire! Oh, & wearing a dayglo vest & then carrying a black rucksack on yer back......stupid.:60277EB7B04744289C0
Click to expand...

No! No pink! The yellow/orange ones are bad enough :A: I'm not that kinda girl, wanting everything in pink. Urgh haha.
Maybe I should just some some DIY on a black backpack and stick reflective strips on it.



NeilFxrs said:
A few months back, some of us here in East Kent went on a free 'Biker Down' riders first aid course run by a fella with the local Fire Brigade (the theory being that often the first person at the scene of a bike accident will be the accompanying 'biker mate). Safe helmet removal, dealing with catastrophic (loss of hands, feet, limbs..) injuries, and also the value, or not, of Hi-Viz gear - essntially I think they were saying it depends on what the background is; ie. it's very easy to miss certain Hi-Viz designs in certain urban settings and you'll actually be camouflaged, same with day-time running lights. We were shown videos of these effects in action, too. I think, due to their successes these courses are being rolled out more widely across the country now and I would recommend 110% that you go along if you get the opportunity.Ride safely
Click to expand...

Sounds interesting, I would definitely be up for taking part if I hear of my local area running one. Thanks for sharing! Interesting about high-vis actually camouflaging you.
 
Re: High Vis

I've taken to making use of the flashing cycle lights in poor visibility, clipped to rucksack straps front and rear makes me that bit more visible :D
 
Re: High Vis

If you ride behind a screen of any sort any Hi-Viz will be very much hidden so when you are riding towards someone, it will make no difference. Most of our rides now have daytime riding lights which can be seen from the front, but many drivers still fail to see them. From behind Hi-Viz may be seen, but how many accidents are actually caused by a biker being hit from behind? As a Traffic Cop in the 70's and early 80's the only Hi-Viz we eventually had was a Sam Brown type belt, and I don't think it made any difference. It has been said many times that when everyone wears Hi-Viz, nobody stands out. I still ride defensively at all times and believe that that is the best life saver.
 
Re: High Vis

Tiz said:
I've taken to making use of the flashing cycle lights in poor visibility, clipped to rucksack straps front and rear makes me that bit more visible :D
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It may be a good idea, but flashing Red and White lights are are illegal on motor vehicles. They are also not legal on cycles as far as I know.
 
Re: High Vis

It's all about freedom of choice.....and personal responsibility.

I don't give a tinker's curse if the Badass Harley Bro (TM) next to me on the highway has no gloves, and is wearing a shorts, trainers and a vest on (it does happen down here quite a lot in summer), but I preserve my right to keep living by not doing that!

I wear high-viz at night on the freeway. That's my version of the percentage game.

I also don't trust ANY DRIVER.

But usually, in daytime, a Shovelhead's loud pipes saves life. This one. :)
 
High viz is complete bollox on a bike. Don't trust it one tiny bit myself. It can effect your visibility but doesn't influence the risk assessment made by your typical bored distracted driver. My last SMIDSY was in my car. He looked, I saw him, but he looked with that blank faced zombi eyed look. It was good daylight, the Morris is white and its about six foot wide and five foot tall. He saw it. But what he saw was the cuddly face on the front of a Morris, which everybody knows is very slow and no danger to anyone, therefore his subconscious had no reason to alert his conscious brain to a possible risk so it didn't, until the screaming of my tyres did. Then he reacted without knowing what he was reacting too and slammed on his brakes thus making the situation worse.
It cost him to get my wing fixed but I'm not convinced he accepts that it was his fault really. Deep down he thinks I materialised from thin air. Because he did look.
I think the only time that hi viz helps is after you've fallen off, it might help motorists not drive over you.
 
Re: High Vis

Hi All,
I don't post much as I don't think I've got much valid to say. When I do it comes out wrong most times, but this is important.

Hi-Vis.
Was made compulsory in France to begin 2013, now that law has been repealed. Not compulsory anymore. Due to group pressure mostly.

Compulsory Lights.
Was made compulsory and still is in many countries but has now, due to studies especially in the USA, been seen to be a false measure of safety. They make riders look further away & travelling slower giving the impression that a you have more time to pull into the traffic stream ahead of the 'SEEN' motorcyclist.

The only thing that saves your life is riding 'defensively', as they say.

Mr. Grewal, potentially put himself in a car driver's blind spot.
I quote:-
'In lane two is a family saloon car and we?re travelling side by side.'

If he is even slightly out of her natural field of vision he was in a blind spot. Normal human vision is 45 degrees either side of centre. Maximum is 80 degrees of centre. Anything beyond that is peripheral and blurred. These are rough figures.

It's 08:00 hours he's riding 'side by side' with a car. DUMB! It's a CAR! Even if the twit driving was not half asleep, doing the morning chore of going to work, then she probably would not have made the extra effort required to check her blind spots, even if she did know what they are. Was Mr. G. able to see her eyes in anyone of her mirrors? If not then she most certainly could not see him.

Studies in the late 70s and early 80s, showed that bright patterned clothing in an urban environment act as camouflage. Walk down any high street and see how many lights, colours etc. there are being displayed.

It was not until quite recently that the British High Way Code had motorcycles included in road traffic scenarios pictured in non motorcycle sections of said publication. No subliminal reinforcement of our existence.
Most car drivers are reminded occasional of motorcycles existence by the now classic 'Beware of low flying stunt riders' road signs. A motorcycle in silhouette, in 'BLACK'.

Add to this that on a really primeval level we as humans react to movement, the sabre toothed tiger leaping at us from a bush, is an extreme, but the movement of a shadow will bring us wide awake. How many times have men been chastised by their women folk for checking out the girls that walk past but failed to notice that we men do the same when it's a man. We just don't stay looking at the man as long unless we see threat.

I wish I had time to search out the studies and add proof to my rant. I don't deny that Hi-Vis helps, more so because it makes you look like a copper than any other reason. Yes Hi-Vis is valid, get some on your rucksack. On your jacket, where ever, Scotch-Brite is the name I think it used to be marketed under. But don't expect it to save your life. Only YOU can do that.

Ride safe, get trained and enjoy.

Rant over.

I'm off for a ride now, in the warm Mediterranean sun. Sorry just had to put that in. I hope it warms up for you all soon. No doubt I'll be back at sea when your enjoying the summer.

Bert.
I live in Spain.
 
Re: High Vis

Kernow said:
It may be a good idea, but flashing Red and White lights are are illegal on motor vehicles. They are also not legal on cycles as far as I know.
Click to expand...

I'm fairly certain that the law has changed to allow cycles to have flashing lights. However, that's the reason I have flashing lights on the rucksack, rather than on the bike. :D
 
Re: High Vis

Interesting thread, I have long believed that riding with my lights on not only wasn't any safer but actually caused drivers to pull out on me as I feel they concentrate on the light and fail to judge the speed of the approaching bike because of it.
A few years ago I had a Yamaha Tenere and the number of cars that pulled out on me increased dramatically over any other bike I have had .My theory on this was that the assumed it was a little trail bike and totally misjudged how fast I was travelling, riding with the lights on made absolutely no difference.I kinda think the same thing happens when you ride with lights on ,it masks the size of the bike and car drivers have very little perception of how fast a bike accelerates,same thing happens with Hi vis, they are so used to small bike/commuters wearing hi vis they totally misjudge the capability of what is coming at them, interestingly it gets even worse in bad weather,is it a subconcious desire to get home before they get wet ?
 
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